tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post3898766168157161079..comments2023-12-16T16:17:43.886+00:00Comments on Fr Ray Blake's Blog: Sacraments and SacramentalsFr Ray Blakehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05584140126211527252noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-13967235126602458392015-09-21T10:52:27.939+01:002015-09-21T10:52:27.939+01:00Jacob, that's very sad. I notice that the FFS...Jacob, that's very sad. I notice that the FFSP priests are keen on sacramentals.gemoftheoceanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05521207668262592414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-54134698189564645172015-09-19T20:53:31.218+01:002015-09-19T20:53:31.218+01:00I recently noticed, two months back, lying as a de...I recently noticed, two months back, lying as a decoration in the fireplace in our parish rooms, while having coffee after Mass, an altar stone. The classic design with the five crosses. No doubt it had covered saints relics. I suspect it had lain there since the 60s/70s.<br /><br />Such is the post-Vat II attitude to sacramentals.<br /><br />I mentioned it to a priest and it has since gone.Jacobihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04743062941733814176noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-3651379705860555432015-09-19T18:54:39.451+01:002015-09-19T18:54:39.451+01:00Frank, I think that was rather late, even modern. ...Frank, I think that was rather late, even modern. For the most part of the Church's history and in most places it was much more like an exchange of contracts, for life, for better or worst,<br />When do you first find it being likened to Ordination? By who?Fr Ray Blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05584140126211527252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-13817690889904007392015-09-19T17:36:02.882+01:002015-09-19T17:36:02.882+01:00"Against the rather confusing idea of sacrame..."Against the rather confusing idea of sacramental marriage one should not forget the Church's place in witnessing, other contracts, vows and treaties, and the reconciliation of enemies and ending feuds, by giving them its blessing, and raising to a sacramental level."<br />I am indeed confused by this statement, particularly that "sacramental marriage is a confusing idea."<br />The sacrament of marriage is not equated with "Church's witnessing" contracts, vows treaties etc. listed above. The sacrament of marriage is frequently equated with the sacrament of ordination. Is that sacrament also "confusing"?fzk5220https://www.blogger.com/profile/01071638907026744982noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-83384471541198444162015-09-19T05:24:49.523+01:002015-09-19T05:24:49.523+01:00Dear Father, dear Readers,
here in Austria and i...Dear Father, dear Readers, <br /><br />here in Austria and in southern Germany, this is still a tradition of visiting shrines (called here pilgrimage Churches) - my own monastery runs a very beautiful one on the northern shores of Lake Constance too, called Birnau. People love to take Holy Water (Weihwasser = blessed water) or Candles or Oil from such Shrines for use at home and there are indeed many verified tales of people and animals being healed or relieved of difficulties throuh such an action. Also, the traditions of blessing newly born farm animals, fields, and things like houses and cars and rosaries etc., is very common and normal. Even secular town councils almost always have new buildings like town halls, fire stations, buses and schools blessed. <br />Another common and very often practiced blessing is that of marriages, at 5, 10, 25, 50 etc. anniversaries. <br />father Raphael Pater Raphaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14700187664220391134noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-12940933425782641952015-09-19T00:04:39.990+01:002015-09-19T00:04:39.990+01:00I think you will have to do the research yourself,...I think you will have to do the research yourself, I dnn't recall reading any websites dealing with this but the mere fact that the laity sought oil to be blessed, that icons and relics exuded oil from at least the beginning of the milenium. It seems pretty well attested that pilgrims took away oil from shrines in the middle ages. Museums contain countless phials from shrines.<br />In the North, as at Canterbury water was distributed that had been touuched by a relic of St Thomas, the same happened Bari but oil rather than water was used, whilst the relics themselves exude St Nicholas' myrrh, which they still do, I have a tiny phial myself. <br />I remember reading accounts of pilgrims to Jerusalem coming away from the Holy Sepulchre with oil from the lamps and oil being used by the sick, and miracles following.<br /><br />It might be worth consulting Bede and Egeria as well as the various rites connected with Saints days. If memory serves me Augustine speaks of the use of blessed oil in the Confessons and there are stories in the Lives ot the Desert Fathers of the sending and receiving of oil. It seems such a commn practice among Christians to anoint in the NT, as it was in the OT, it is part of the culture of the Mediterranean region, and was in the pagan period as in the Christian.Fr Ray Blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05584140126211527252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-48005686057357121042015-09-18T23:52:20.072+01:002015-09-18T23:52:20.072+01:00In my parish here in Western Australia, at Easter,...In my parish here in Western Australia, at Easter, when the water is blessed the parish priest puts out little bottles of the blessed water for people to take home so that they have blessed water in their homes. I have one right now in my home, just as we used to have when I was a child.JARayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18138004129894177863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-73238539403274412032015-09-18T18:52:25.126+01:002015-09-18T18:52:25.126+01:00"However there does seem to be evidence at so..."However there does seem to be evidence at some period and in some places deacons prayed over and anointed the sick with oil. This might well have been sacramental anointing but not necessarily the sacrament of anointing, of course this was before the Church defined the number of sacraments. At this time of course there is lots more evidence of lay people anointing than deacons anointing"<br /><br />Can you state what "evidence" there "seems to be?" What is/are the source(s)? Where is the "lots more evidence of lay people anointing..." evidence and, preferably, source for making these assertions/claims?<br /><br />I realize you are probably repeating the assertions/claims from the liturgical website, but no one 'seems' to be able to answer the question of what the evidence and lots more evidence really is....<br /><br />Where are the sources to be found for these claims about the ancient use of blessed oil used for the sick?<br /><br />Sincerely,<br />TomTomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15071246547678293015noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31069882.post-84234212670018673712015-09-18T17:30:48.992+01:002015-09-18T17:30:48.992+01:00Dear Father Blake:
A month or so back, we had 2 Su...Dear Father Blake:<br />A month or so back, we had 2 Sundays back to back where Catholics after the Traditional Latin Mass; brought items to the Altar Rail to have blessed in the old Rite of 1962.The Priest was very patient, and accommodating. We Love Him, and what he represents!<br />To see the rail lined with faithful, and then many more just behind them was very moving!<br />Bottles, and bottles of water to be made Holy in the old Rite. Salt, medals, statues, pictures, rosaries scapulars.<br />Father Blake, we the children of the Church have not surrendered the power of the Church, and Her priesthood.<br />We embrace, and wait for any opportunity to reap those gifts from God.<br />Father please know, we are here in great numbers, praying and waiting.Donhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09159082647234191062noreply@blogger.com