I thought I had seen the ridiculous side of the Church but here is the pits.
There is nothing worst than mutton pretending to be lamb. If this is what these men think is going to inspire "the youth", heaven help us.
h/t Rorate
added later
... and yes it was used at Mass
52 comments:
I'm sure somebody said recently that "the Carnival is over." If only that were true.
It's like seeing someone you love made the butt of a joke.
Fr. I. Saw myself feeling uncomfortable and not fitting into the actions of 'church'. But when. I looked closely, I saw 'joys'. This is church together, trying to follow Jesus, the message, Our God above all, who will care for us, regardless of how we see each other. Thank you for your blogs - I may not agree but always I am stimulated to think about how I belong. God bless you
Well I found the bishop in the baseball cap inspiring. All those antics remind me so much of my days in the charismatic church and the nuremberg rally feel of the "church" services. It is laugh able but because this is the Bride of Christ it is more depressing.
As my young adult children would say:
"Epic Fail"
Thanks for this. I wonder are the bishops sheepish fools or foolish sheep?
I have taken the liberty of republishing the video on blog.
Naff beyond words, but to those flower children who are now in their 60s and 70s, it must make them feel very nostalgic.
How ridiculous , what on earth were they thinking of .Had I been there , I would have walked out as soon as it started .This is the state that our church is now in , so no wonder that people are leaving .So depressing .
I don't know whether to laugh or cry, it's just cringe making.
These bishops must think they are appealing to "yoof"; but they really need a World Middle-Aged Day of their own.
I enjoyed that,it goes to show that we can still enjoy ourselves.Happy people is what we are short of especially in this Parish where one half hates the other half.
There has been so much misery about the scandalous behaviour of our leaders in this part of the world we are in danger of disappearing altogether.
So this "youth": what age is he? About three and a half?
The sad thing is that, none of these clowns - what else can we call them - as far as I could see, walked away.
I have commented elsewhere on the similarity between the Arian heresy period when the Church was betrayed by the majority (but not all) of the then bishops, and the present period.
It seems the parallel is becoming ever stronger. The Church in the last fifty years has been, and still is, sorely afflicted.
Father Ray,
Have you only casted your net in the UK? WYD Brazil will never be understood unless one has served in Missions abroad.
Some miscellaneous and incomplete thoughts on this:
1. I have not been able to follow the words being sung in the video, but the context is not one of a Liturgical celebration strictly so called. Do not the events portrayed reflect the freedom that is appropriate to the devotional, in the technical sense? It may not appeal to all, but that does not over rule its legitimacy for the particular devotional context.
2. "Action prayers" do have a devotional efficacy (in my view). The sign of the Cross is archetypal, but actions to accompany the words of a song also work. Whenever I have been present at an event where such has been the practice, my own hesitation to join in has usually been totally respected by others present - that some will pray more discretely simply hasn't been an issue. Whether this is an appropriate observation here I do not know, since I haven't been able to follow the words in the video, and it may well reflect more a concert type context than an adoration type context.
3. A bit more thoughtfulness on the part of the young people might have allowed the bishops present to "opt out" of the actions if they wished. I suspect the bishops were put into an impossible situation - which wasn't really fair on them.
4. Again, an observation that is qualified by my not understanding the full context of the video. This style (of devotion) should not in my view be evaluated simply by reference to a particular generation or time in the life of the Church. The evaluation needs to engage more fully with the particular qualities of the music/style - and quite possibly the charism of a particular movement in the Church that gives rise to that music/style. Any one particular instance might well be open to positive and/or negative evaluations, but that needs to be offered on more precise grounds.
5. And does not traditional Catholicism also have a devotional style of its own that doesn't appeal to everyone?
Nick,
Be part of the solution rather than the problem.
If I may comment on Lola’s remark.
I have spent a lot of time in South America and am as reasonably familiar with the culture both religious and non-religious as any non-resident can be.
These bishops are behaving like clowns. I have a better word in my local dialect but most of you wouldn’t understand it.
Latin American young people, sadly, will have so many of their prejudices confirmed.
When the music stops will WYD have made a difference? I guess it will for the young people present.
I think they were trying to keep warm. Apparently, you feel the cold more as you get older.
Gay humility in the style of gay pride.
It looks like The Wiggles have taken over MC duties for WYD Masses.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mphEg-bwMAg
Dad-dancing at its worst. If only the Bishops present would put so much enthusiasm into cleaning up the mess in their own dioceses we might get somewhere. As it is we all know they'll go home and do nothing and all the problems in the seminaries, liturgy and catechesis will persist. The young people present may be enthusiastic for authentic Catholicism but they are up against a liberal clericalist elite that will continue to try and suffocate it and shape it after their own fashion.
Try to understand the difficult position those bishops are in. If they conform they look like fools. If they object they are part of the Church's problem. They look uncomfortable and they know it.
SACRA PROPEDIEM
ENCYCLICAL OF POPE BENEDICT XV
ON THE THIRD ORDER OF ST. FRANCIS
(...)Now there are two passions today dominant in the profound lawlessness of morals - an unlimited desire of riches and an insatiable thirst for pleasures. It is this which marks with a shameful stigma our epoch; whilst it goes ceaselessly from progress to progress in the order of all which touches the well-being and convenience of life, it seems that in the superior order of honesty and of moral rectitude a lamentable retrogression leads it back to the ignominies of ancient paganism. In that measure, in truth, wherein men lose sight of eternal goods which Heaven reserved for them, they permit themselves to be more taken in by the deceitful mirage of the ephemeral goods here below, and once their souls are turned down towards the earth, an easy descent leads them insensibly to relax themselves in virtue, to experience repugnance for spiritual things, and to relish nothing outside the seductions of pleasure.
(…) From this point of view one cannot sufficiently deplore the blindness of so many women of every age and condition; made foolish by desire to please, they do not see to what a degree the in decency of their clothing shocks every honest man, and offends God. Most of them would formerly have blushed for those toilettes as for a grave fault against Christian modesty; now it does not suffice for them to exhibit them on the public thoroughfares; they do not fear to cross the threshold of the churches, to assist at the Holy sacrifice of the Mass, and even to bear the seducing food of shameful passions to the Eucharistic Table where one receives the heavenly Author of purity. And We speak not of those exotic and barbarous dances recently imported into fashionable circles, one more shocking than the other; one cannot imagine anything more suitable for banishing all the remains of modesty.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xv/encyclicals/documents/hf_ben-xv_enc_06011921_sacra-propediem_en.html
Millions of pilgrims took part in the world's largest flash mob, by performing a simple dance for the Pope. In fact, the title of the song they danced to is called 'Francis.' Before celebrating Sunday's closing Mass in Rio's Copacabana beach, millions of youths took a few minutes to carry out the performance.
The choreography was created by two Brazilian professional dancers, who actually created a video beforehand, so people could practice the moves, before the big day.
http://www.romereports.com/palio/massive-flash-mob-performed-for-pope-francis-english-10691.html#.UfVAz40vnvY
THE
PRELATE
PRANCE
Solidarity
In their dance
Doin', doin'
The Prelate prance.
Fraternal Fathers
At a glance
Doin', doin'
The Prelate prance.
Of it, luv it
Rio's romance
Doin', doin'
The Prelate prance.
Traditional Priest
Then takes a stance
Scorned, derided
Left to chance
But Chalice of chance
Consecrates to advance
"Come follow Me..."
A True Lord of the Dance!
Another proof that the need to conform to the group can be overwhelming. Well, that's the most optimistic interpretation I can come up with. Otherwise we are left with pop-episcopacy...
Do you really, seriously think one single person there will be in any way convinced of the truth of the teachings of our Lord Jesus Christ and His Church by the buffoonish cavortings of these foolish old men? They will only make the young people smirk in embarrassment.
Chloe
It all looks rather self-referential to me.
Pep rally!
Reginald, You wrote "Gay humility in the style of gay pride" What on earth does sexual orientation have to do with this situation?
Waiting for them to do the Macarena dance.
It's the "spirit of Vatican 2". Forget the previous councils. Vatican supersedes them all! Just joking!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hf-tbXPgN0o&feature=share&list=UUX17igkZ9JhU64JoTBVSWeQ
@ parepidemos
Your question is a rhetorical question, isn´t it?
Lighten up you lot!!!!!! Your reaction to this little bit of light relief is utterly ridiculous! You haven't got a clue - your behaviour since Pope Benedict resigned is disgraceful! As you know I speak as someone who loves the Latin Mass. Please drop the bitterness and learn from pope Francis!
First impressions are not necessarily accurate. We are looking at events in South America, a continent with a vastly different culture to our own. We judge subjectively, we might feel uncomfortable about the public display of faith and emotion, we might not like it, but who are we to judge? Let us not forget the presence, words, and spirituality of Pope Francis, remembering that it was for Him - as Christ's representative on earth, that millions of young people were there. By amplifying one small incident which we 'consider' rather unedifying, we are in danger of diminishing the whole, and forgetting the inspiring public witness to Christ's Church,with undoubtedly many graces and blessings bestowed on all those involved.
'Saints Peter and Paul, pray for us'
Have any of you read 2 Samuel 6:1-23 recently? Leah berated David for dancing before The Lord but he replied, 'I was dancing for The Lord, not for them ... As The Lord lives who chose me ... To make me a leader ... I shall dance before The Lord God and demean myself even more.' Our bishops were pleasing to The Lord. If you looked closely at their faces you could see their sincerity. What a wonderful thing. I'd much rather be on David's side than Leah's, wouldn't you?
I remember being at a Legion of Mary dinner where a nun brought along a tape on which she had composed a song, got us to learn it there and then and do a dance to it. When I tried to sneak off to the loo to avoid the embarrassment, I was grabbed by another nun and asked where I thought I was going. I had to endure it..
Father, Your thoughts on the pope's restriction of the Latin Mass for the Franciscans of the Immaculate, please. And on his comments on homosexuals?
Why do we have to put up with this? Ageing hippies screwing with the truth. I am almost through with it. It's like having John Prescott as pope, or Joe Biden. Say exactly the first thing you think, regardless of everything else you or the Church has said before.
It is not much fun being a faithful Catholic these days. Are we meant to be happy, skipping along like drunk teenagers after posturing idiots?
Don't feel you need publish this - there's very few we can talk to.
@Martina Katholik
My question to Reginald regarding his comment is not at all rhetorical. What on earth does homosexual orientation have to do with the bishops waving their arms in the video?
Pope Francis stops the celebration of the TLM by the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate as of Aug 11 and he states that he will not "judge" homosexual priests. Fits right in with bishops dancing in vestments at Holy Mass.
There really are 2 different "Catholic" religions.
At least they are not dancing in pairs.
Funny how the gossips are running riot. How come noone is quoting the official website of the Franciscans of the Immaculate where the homilist for today says:
Jul 29 – Homily – Fr Benedict: Don’t Worry So Much About Things
Monday, July 29th, 2013
Click to Play
Homily #130729 ( 08min) Play - On this feast of St. Martha, Father reminds us not to be so anxious about everyday things and not to worry about the future, of which have no control, and to give today and tomorrow all to the Lord. Ave Maria!
Mass: St. Martha, Virgin – 3rd Cl – Form: EF, Dilexisti
Commemoration: St. Felix and Companions
Readings:
1st: 2co 10:17-18 11:1-2
Gsp: luk 10:38-42
umblepiesaid... "Let us not forget the presence, words, and spirituality of Pope Francis, remembering that it was for Him - as Christ's representative on earth, that millions of young people were there."
What do you think it means that the Pope is Jesus' representative on Earth? We've had some pretty vicious and political Popes over the centuries, so the definition has to be big enough to fit all of them.
Second, if the young people are traveling to see the Pope, it does not follow that they are appearing for the words and spirituality of Bergoglio. As the Pope would say, they are there for Jesus.
The question remains, is the Pope offering the same Jesus that the Church has always offered, or is he offering them Bergoglio's Jesus? This is a fair question. The Church cautions against reducing Catholic spirituality, even based on the teachings of a great Saint like Thomas or Francis.
I wonder whether Archbishop Marini thought he would ever see anything like this again at a Papal Mass?
Some of these Anti-Pope comments would have caught the eye of Queen Mary
@nickbris.
Doubtful that Queen Mary can read the comments through her tears.
"When the music stops will WYD have made a difference?"
Of course it will. And maybe for as long as a day or two. Possibly even for a week - or until these kids have their next disco night out.
Wait a minute. That was IN BRAZIL: WHERE NINE MILLION AFRICAN SLAVES WERE SENT. The culture is SATURATED WITH AFRICAN CULTURAL APPROVAL OF DANCE AND SONG ON THE SPUR OF THE MOMENT. Now it is true that present African culture KNOWS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SACRED AND SECULAR POPULAR MUSIC AND DANCE, in Brazil, it is less clear. What I saw was that MUCH OF THE MUSIC WAS SECULAR,eg. classical secular pieces woven into the liturgy when there were good religious alternatives that could have been used. BUT I ALSO SAW THAT THE MUSIC HAD A DEPTH OF RELIGIOUS FEELING AT ALL THE KEY POINTS OF THE LITURGY. And for the young of the world MUSIC IS THEIR LITURGY. One tolerates it for the affirmation of the Youth's enthusiasm. Note that the Holy Father was VERY SERIOUS IN HIS PERSON AND MESSAGE DURING ALL THIS. It's something that's ok in Brazil. One volunteer from Britain testified that when he went to a family expecting him they greeted him with SONG AND DANCE. IOW the feeling was real, and it moved the young to listen to the Holy Father with reverence in the right places. padro4668@gmail.com
The choir was dressed in Pentecostal choir dress. This sums it up, and it goes beyond WYD. Immediacy, if it is not all smiles and joy it is has failed the Holy Spirit test. We shall see how long the plasters stem the flow from what is a deep cut in a major artery - What we are witnessing is a move form faith and reason to a purely "feelings" led faith. The consequences don’t bare thinking about: Matt 16: 18, Matt 4:7
Thank you, I hadn't seen that before. I didn't think it looked so very bad. There has been some mockery here about the 'Dad dancing' style, but then what Dad hasn't had to do that, sometime or other?
It might have been helpful for you to have added a translation of the words, since I assume that the people and bishops had been moved to dance by the words? If so (and depending on the words, of course), then why not dance?
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