Lest it be taken out of context, here is the exchange that took place on the pope's plane. The question's premise was "The Catholic Church's position on the way to fight against AIDS is often considered unrealistic and ineffective," and the pope responded:
"I would say the opposite. I think that the reality that is most effective, the most present and the strongest in the fight against AIDS, is precisely that of the Catholic Church, with its programs and its diversity. I think of the Sant'Egidio Community, which does so much visibly and invisibly in the fight against AIDS ... and of all the sisters at the service of the sick.
"I would say that one cannot overcome this problem of AIDS only with money -- which is important, but if there is no soul, no people who know how to use it, (money) doesn't help.
"One cannot overcome the problem with the distribution of condoms. On the contrary, they increase the problem.
"The solution can only be a double one: first, a humanization of sexuality, that is, a spiritual human renewal that brings with it a new way of behaving with one another; second, a true friendship even and especially with those who suffer, and a willingness to make personal sacrifices and to be with the suffering. And these are factors that help and that result in real and visible progress.
"Therefore I would say this is our double strength -- to renew the human being from the inside, to give him spiritual human strength for proper behavior regarding one's own body and toward the other person, and the capacity to suffer with the suffering. ... I think this is the proper response and the church is doing this, and so it offers a great and important contribution. I thank all those who are doing this."
The pope's words reflected a statement he made to South African bishops in 2005, when he noted that the church is in the forefront in the treatment of AIDS and said the "only fail-safe way" to prevent its spread is found in the church's traditional teaching on sexual responsibility.
In saying that condom-promotion programs only increase the problem, the pope appeared to agree with those who have put forward several arguments: that condoms have a failure rate and so are never completely safe; that encouragement of condom use may promote promiscuity, a factor in the spread of HIV, the virus that causes AIDS; and that reliance on condom campaigns has overshadowed more effective means of prevention, namely fidelity and chastity.
There is another factor in the pope's thinking, according to an Italian theologian, Franciscan Father Maurizio Faggioni, who has advised the Vatican on sexual morality issues. The pope sees condom campaigns as a question of cultural violence, especially in Africa, where there has never been a "contraceptive mentality," Father Faggioni said.
The question of whether condom use in some circumstances may be morally acceptable is a separate and more difficult question, Father Faggioni told Catholic News Service.
Catholic News Service.
"I would say the opposite. I think that the reality that is most effective, the most present and the strongest in the fight against AIDS, is precisely that of the Catholic Church, with its programs and its diversity. I think of the Sant'Egidio Community, which does so much visibly and invisibly in the fight against AIDS ... and of all the sisters at the service of the sick.
"I would say that one cannot overcome this problem of AIDS only with money -- which is important, but if there is no soul, no people who know how to use it, (money) doesn't help.
"One cannot overcome the problem with the distribution of condoms. On the contrary, they increase the problem.
"The solution can only be a double one: first, a humanization of sexuality, that is, a spiritual human renewal that brings with it a new way of behaving with one another; second, a true friendship even and especially with those who suffer, and a willingness to make personal sacrifices and to be with the suffering. And these are factors that help and that result in real and visible progress.
"Therefore I would say this is our double strength -- to renew the human being from the inside, to give him spiritual human strength for proper behavior regarding one's own body and toward the other person, and the capacity to suffer with the suffering. ... I think this is the proper response and the church is doing this, and so it offers a great and important contribution. I thank all those who are doing this."
The pope's words reflected a statement he made to South African bishops in 2005, when he noted that the church is in the forefront in the treatment of AIDS and said the "only fail-safe way" to prevent its spread is found in the church's traditional teaching on sexual responsibility.
In saying that condom-promotion programs only increase the problem, the pope appeared to agree with those who have put forward several arguments: that condoms have a failure rate and so are never completely safe; that encouragement of condom use may promote promiscuity, a factor in the spread of HIV, the virus that causes AIDS; and that reliance on condom campaigns has overshadowed more effective means of prevention, namely fidelity and chastity.
There is another factor in the pope's thinking, according to an Italian theologian, Franciscan Father Maurizio Faggioni, who has advised the Vatican on sexual morality issues. The pope sees condom campaigns as a question of cultural violence, especially in Africa, where there has never been a "contraceptive mentality," Father Faggioni said.
The question of whether condom use in some circumstances may be morally acceptable is a separate and more difficult question, Father Faggioni told Catholic News Service.
Catholic News Service.
8 comments:
Well Father, it has already been taken out of context. As usual the MSM has cherry-picked the Holy Father’s words in pursuit of a headline-grabbing soundbite: “Pope creates firestorm…” “Pope says condoms make Aids worse” etc.
In typical secular reporting fashion the usual suspects are rounded up for comments: Catholics For Choice and Planned Parenthood - who assert that the Pope is ‘out of touch’ with the modern world. Then for ‘balance’ the pronouncements of Cardinals Martini and Barragan on ‘judicious use’ of condoms are trotted out.
Shades of 1968 and Humanae Vitae…
Spiralling levels of AIDS, rampant promiscuous sex, STD's, teenage pregnancies, abortion, breakdown of family life etc...
WHEN WILL THE SECULAR WORLD EVER LEARN??? CONDOMS ARE THE PROBLEM NOT THE SOLUTION. THEY DO NOT WORK AND ESPECIALLY NOT AGAINST THE AIDS VIRUS. WHY? BECAUSE THESE VIRAL PARTICLES ARE SMALL ENOUGH TO PASS THROUGH THE PORES IN THE RUBBER, AND THAT'S ASSUMING THE DAMN THING DOESN'T FALL OFF ETC...
The Pope is spot on and of course the wise teaching of the Catholic Church is timeless, borne of 2000 years of experience and pastoral care for the sick and needy, both in body, mind and spirit.
50 and more years of banging on about condoms, sex education and yet more condoms has brought us to where we are at the moment - in absolute dire straits!
'The fire is out of control' so the Planned Parenthoods of this world shout 'more condoms and more sex-ed' which is nothing more than pouring petrol on the fire! And it is costing a fortune, whereas to change behaviour, attitudes, hearts and minds doesn't need to cost anything at all. And that's the problem - IPPF et al fear that unless they are providing condoms and abortions to everyone they will go bust!
Frankly the sooner the better as for sure the world will be a far better place without them and their murderous ilk!
Papa Benedict speaks the Truth, but of course satan doesn't like this so as master of the secular media he lets rip! I am sure our beloved Pope is unflustered by this media 'noise', it's only to be expected. But the Truth needs to be proclaimed from the rooftops.
Africa must protect all it's children, those born and those as yet unborn because there lies Africa's future.
In April of 2006, the Pope himself wanted his health office under Cardinal Barragan to do a study to submit to I believe the CDF on condoms and HIV. I suspect what is still being looked into has nothing to do with those who fornicate or commit adultery. I think the Vatican is concerned for married people in Africa wherein one has HIV and whether e.g. condoms could be used during infertile times noted by NFP methods (tried years ago in Africa) so that the unitive would not be separated from the procreative during those time periods since there would be moral certitude of there being no procreative status at the time.
Some will say the solution is the Josephite marriage automatically and why would the Pope even wonder.
And that would be true if the New Testament did not note two groups of Christians...spiritual and the more carnal...the latter of which was enjoined to marry to avoid fornication. If they obey and marry to avoid fornication and within a year, the couple is faced with HIV in one of them, then how do the more carnal suddenly become capable of the Josephite marriage which the more spitual can become capable of since to the more spiritual Paul had said: I Cor. 7:27 "Are you free of a wife? Then do not look for a wife...If you marry, however, you do not sin"...but to the more carnal Paul had said:I Corinthians 7:9
"...but if they cannot exercise self-control they should marry, for it is better to marry than to be on fire".
That is the dilemna the Vatican must solve with actual thinking rather than answers that are appropo to one group for sure but not so readily to the other group.
Mary e.g. according to Aquinas had no concupiscence once she was bearing Christ so she did not have a Josephite marriage... only Joseph did and he is like the more spiritual Christians of the epistles and was older likely and he was not like the more carnal who were told that to marry was better than to burn with desire and that they should do it to avoid fornication. Oddly enough, Augustine had he not turned to celibacy within Orders would have been in this area of life, one of the more carnal. And Monica had know that and had found him a woman to marry after he dismissed his mistress of many years but the woman Monica found was too young and Augustine too carnal and he states that he could not wait and so took still another mistress.
It is the Vatican's job to ruminate about this more carnal group within marriage and not pretend without thinking that the more carnal are capable of what the more spiritual are capable of...and the Vatican must think of their situation with HIV which some studies show is blocked but only by very precise scrupulous use of condoms or two of them and with obsessive caution and the question is whether the Vatican will see this as feasible during the infertile times when it would not be separating the procreative from the unitive. All this is still going on in Rome in some form of thinking or the other.
Do the journalists ever carp that we should be handing out clean needles in schools because the kids are going to "shoot up anyway?"
On another note I wonder what he watched in-flight. :-D
‘The Catholic Church is the only thing which saves a man from the degrading slavery of being a child of his age’ G K Chesterton
True ability to interpret scripture and preserve the teachings of Christ are only fully possible within the Catholic Church.
Thank you Pope Benedict for standing up for the truth, however hard people interpret it to be. If we follow the Makers instruction all will be well.
George, it is a known FACT that condoms do not work. IPP KNOWS this. They are NOT stupid. When study after study demonstrate that promotion and use of condoms increases the spread of AIDS and IPP, UN says MORE MORE then the only logical conclusion a rational intelligent person can draw is that the intention is to spread AIDS.
Its really not a complex problem
Probabity of cathing AIDS = n x p
where n = the number of times you have sex and p is the probabilty of infection. Let's GENEROUSLY assume condoms reduce p by 70%. Now add to that mix the false claim that condom use means safe sex, what do you think will happen to n. Yes, people will be prepared to risk having more sex because they think they are protected. Not only that, they would also risk increasing p by not being more vigilent with partner selection.
Bilbannon, you cannot put the person you are supposed to love in mortal danger surely. I never found that argument regarding "what about people who are married" particularly convincing. If you love your spouse you would rather cut of your gibblets than expose them to a killer disease. Frankly, I think the argument is based upon iresponsible lust parading as care and love of ones spouse. Given the pathetic performance of condoms, it is beyond contempt to see them as somehow okay for married people where one partner has a killer disease. In fact, it is less okay than using condoms fornicating with a stranger. Why?, because your supposed to love your spouse and take care of him/her. Where is love of neighbour when you can't even love your husband or wife enough to keep them safe.
Ma Tucker
No...I read a study some years ago that showed that with obsessive care in the use of condoms, the one test group had zero transmission of the disease. And other reports note 90% effectiveness because no one in most studies is using obsessive care like using two rather than one should there be breakage.
The Vatican official, Cardinal Trujillo who years ago stated that the disease could go through little holes in the condoms did not do the Church a favor as to its credibility in the educated world. Indeed he may have helped the Church's opponents immeasureably. As the Old Testament says, "Without knowledge, even zeal is not good."
bilbannon - Ma Tucker is right, the Pope is right, Cardinal Trujillio was right, there are countless SCIENTIFIC studies that are right - but no one is listening, WHY? because the world has removed the unitive from the procreative and turned sex and pleasure into a multi $million industry. If the slogan 'be safe - use condoms' was blown apart by the WHO taking note of any of the 'real science' out there, the sex industry would be dead in the water! That's the problem!!! Too many people make too much money out of all these condoms used to exploit vulnerable people, prostitutes and young children, and they don't give a stuff about human beings contracting HIV or dying from AIDS!
Care to check out the following article bilbannon, assuming you are truely looking for knowledge, as the Old Testament says:
"Are Condoms Really Safe?
Fact: Latex condoms have tiny intrinsic holes called “voids.” The AIDS virus is 50 times smaller than these tiny holes which makes it easy for the virus to pass through them, (1) about as easy as a dime passing through a basketball hoop.
Conclusion: Telling somebody to put a mere balloon between their health and a deadly disease is irresponsible. It’s like telling someone it’s okay to drink and drive as long as they wear a seat belt.
(1) Dr. C. M. Roland, editor of Rubber Chemistry and Technology, letter to the editor, The Washington Times, 4/22/92, p. G-2
According to an article by the Alan Guttmacher Institute, published in Planned Parenthood's Family Planning Perspectives May/June 1989, condoms have an 11.4 to 22.3 percent failure rate among teens. Studies of five brands of condoms, reported in the British Journal of Medicine July 11, 1987, showed a failure rate of 26 percent due to rupture and slippage alone. And the New England Journal of Medicine Mar. 23, 1989 showed condoms have a failure rate of 10 to 33 percent for preventing pregnancies in women 25 years and younger.
Industry admits naturally occurring defects
Even intact condoms have naturally occurring defects (tiny holes penetrating the entire thickness) measuring five to 50 microns in diameter -- 50 to 500 times the size of the HIV virus, writes C. Michael Roland, head of the Polymer Properties Section at the Naval Research laboratory in Washington, D.C. and editor of Rubber Chemistry and Technology, in a published letter to the Washington Times.
In other words, just as rubber tires, over time, lose air, condoms (manufactured of the same product, rubber) also are porous.
"... the rubber comprising latex condoms has intrinsic voids about 5 microns (0.0002 inches) in size," Roland states. "Contrarily, the AIDS virus is only 0.1 micron (4 millionths of an inch) in size. Since this is a factor of 50 smaller than the voids inherent in rubber, the virus can readily pass through the condom."
In addition, condom manufacturers allow 0.4 percent of any given batch to be defective, before a recall is ordered.
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32,000 pin holes per condom
Although the term "pin holes" is not entirely scientifically accurate as pin holes are quite large, the point is worth mentioning that the condom itself is NOT anywhere near 100 % safe and reliable. Latex rubber has natural holes in it's stretchy "fabric" that allow viruses to go through. So why are we being told to use them? It was a political decision based on fear, and public demand for answers.
Consider these results of examination which show the following :
A condom is made of rubber (latex), a hydrocarbon compound with polymerization, which means that it is fibrous and porous like woven cloth. By means of an electronic microscope the pores of the condom can be seen in a non-stretched state with a width of 1/60 micron, while the HIV/AIDS virus has a width of 1/250 micron. When the condom is stretched the pores of the condom are 10 times as wide as that of the virus; in other words, the virus can go through the wall of the condom. The condom was designed for family planning (to strain sperm, not viruses); and a condom is not meant for fornication/prostitution.
Research carried out in the U.S. on 89 condoms in circulation on the market proved that 29 out of 89 leaked, which means that the leakage was about 30 %. In Indonesia condoms imported from Hong Kong in 1996 were withdrawn from market because 50 % leaked. In practice in the field there is often failure of condoms use for family planning because of leakage,
let alone for fornication/prostitution. As a comparison, sperm are as large as oranges and viruses as large as a period (dot).
Another examination conducted in the U.S. ( the Physical Division of Human Sciences, Maryland, USA, 1992) showed that particles as minute as viruses can be detected going through the wall of condoms.
In every condom there are 0.4 % pinhole, microscopic defect in the manufacturing process. The area of the condom is 80 cm2 and if you count 32,000 pinhole in each condom, and if each pinhole is 1/1000 micron, you can imagine the total number of pinholes in a condom.
Based on the above finding, the anti-AIDS campaign in the U.S. no longer uses the Safe Sex Use Condoms slogan, but just the reverse (a turn of 180 degrees).
At the same time an expert of the university of Utah, Professor Victor Cline, state in 1995 that if we believe that by using condoms we are protected from sexually transmitted diseases including the HIV/AIDS virus, we really have gone astray.
if condoms don't protect me what will?
Viruses all travel by air. We breath them in every day. They land on our food. Then end up in the toilet.
Most of the time we don't get sick BECAUSE we usually take good care of ourselves and our bodies just flush them out. Healthy living will protect you better than anything"!
Now why can't people accept this instead of pumping out the same old rubbish despite ALL the evidence pointing to the contrary.
Faithfullness and abstinence, the humanization of sexuality and finding true friendship between people rather than simply looking at exploitation. This is what the Catholic Church teaches and what Pope Benedict spoke about.
Sorry it's a bit of a long comment Fr Ray, but where do you stop on this issue which is so deeply and deliberately rooted in a mire of misinformation and far too many people are dying needlessly because of it.
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